Wow Alisa, right on point as usual!!!
I found so much truth in your response, & enjoyed the two diff opinions (Seth's & yours). I found both explainations to represent exactly how I feel about this & why I feel torn, but pulled to the ultimate feeling that it's just wrong - but not w/out being right at the exact same time. For example, I know what Seth writes to be true, I just know this at a soul level I guess, because everything he said sums up what I hear in my head. I'll use your term of "inserted thought" Alisa, like this for instance...
I wrote...It really is a tough question, because we inadvertently act on a human level first it seems, then after the initial human thought of "Kill anyone who threatens to hurt the ones I love!" passes, the thoughts from my soul that is of a higher consciousness say, "But is this your decision to make?"
I feel that something on a spiritual level, an entity, guide, God is saying this in my head(Aaagh it's the voices again!!!).
Also it's something I have just always felt, despite my human feelings on the subject of to kill or not to kill.
Seth wrote... Usually there are a variety of physical actions, not involving killing that would suffice. As long as you believe that violence must be met with violence you court it and its consequences.
And this is what I actually consider to be Karma. Alot of people mistake Karma for a type of spiritual vendetta, almost like a punishment, when in actuality it is just energy attraction, just as Seth(Jane Roberts) says, but just doesn't use the word
Karma. I'm not insinuating that you think this Alisa, I just mean to say that alot of people view Karma as a negative punishment from God per say, instead of looking at it like an example of science. If you are wired to attract the same energies to yourself that you emit, then if it's negative that you are - it's negative that you get back. And the same goes for positive, these positive energies that we recieve, when we eminate pos energies from ourselves, aren't "rewards" as some would say, I believe that it's cause and effect for us, with the laws of attraction that we live by on this planet.
Mom used to say to me when I was in in JR. High & complaining about some friend, "Put out what you want back, if it's a friend that will never fail you that you want, then be that friend to all that you know. If it's a friend that is always honest that you want, than be
that to all that you know, it will come back to you because that's the way we're built.", she used to say "
Be all that
is what you
want back from the universe, and the universe will comply." And I found that you can't just be that way
sometimes, you have to be that person & own it as how you treat all, not just the few select that you know & value in your life. And it has always proven to be true to me at least, because when you look at the positive & negative things that happen throughout one's life, it's easy to judge these things as punishments and rewards from God/Source. But really I don't see God as one who punishes, so that throws the neg energy right out of the punishment catagorey. Then take the positive things that happen to people for example...many believe that these are direct rewards from God/source. I also have a problem w/this just a bit, & this is why, if God doesn't punish, then why would he reward? Don't get me wrong, I do believe that God rewards us, but not on a human level so much as on a spiritual level once we return to the other side. And by rewards I don't mean what we would necessarily consider a reward w/our ego based human mind. Evolving spiritually is the most givin reward, & one that not just God, but that also WE give ourselves.
I think that God pretty much let Karma be the judge so to speak, because God doesn't judge. So what would be the best way for God to let us learn the ropes w/out having us live in fear of being judged for every little thing? Create a failsafe system where we create our own punishments & rewards w/out the fear of being judged by him.Kind of like a flat rate a cab driver might give one traveling a long distance, instead of charging you for every single mile, you get a hard price, & it doesn't change it's always that same price even if there's a detour.So instead of God having to play judge, he left if up to us to judge & tweek ourselves, simply by giving us a scale to live by & a very simple one at that..."Mirror the kind of person & experinces that you would like to attract." That is what I have always believed Karma to be - simple cause & effect of the way we & our planet were set up to coexist. And we learn our lessons by this Karma, as well as our achievements in a very nonjudgemental way because of this system.
I really think I'll look up this Jane Roberts, as I see myself possibly connecting with her channeled words on an eye to eye level. Thank you for always including the authors of the quotes you use Alisa. I have gathered so much new reading material from you!
Now onto my second point wich is this...
Alisa wrote...My based on my latest fav writings The Impersonal Life, I would say with confidence that all that occurs (murder, etc.) is God's will in order to hone our imperfectness of body. If we chose to punish criminals, that is a vital learning experience for those being punished and those doing the punishing, otherwise it would not be happening at all in our reality. It is something that has to be experienced over and over in order to realize the futility and to thus turn our desire-to-control over to God.
Love this
!!!! And couldn't agree more, it is supposed to be this way because it's mostly the negative that I believe we humans come here to let our souls experience, & if what Seth says is true(like I somehow know), then even if we kill to set laws & boundries for our own protection, it's still wrong to kill. So if that is our race's plan for punishment(to kill in some cases), as much as it suits us for the place we live(earth), we are still supposed to rise above & evolve. Rise above the hatered, the judgement, the punishing, and the NEED to punish & kill. To allow ourselves to leave it in God's hands when someone wrongs us. And how do I believe God handles it? Judgement? Nope. Wraith? Nope. Karma. YEP. Why? Because that's his flatrate way of letting us set our own boundries instead of setting them for us, then punishing us when we cross them. Kind of a "live & learn" way, VS. a "follow & obey" way of living life. Free will & the natural achievements & consequences that our decisions & energy pull towards us.
Alisa wrote... How I interpret what happens is this...when you get to a point through the many life lessons and honing by God's will that you no longer feel desire to participate in such things, then you stop, because your will is now aligned with God's purpose and desire to manifest perfection through physical humanity. And that is when you begin to "ascend" for lack of a better word. In other words, you don't really have to try (It's more like you have to endure the painful process of shedding ego, facing fear, letting go). It will begin to feel distasteful participating in body-fear actions such as violence. Then you will begin to overcome reactions of fight/flight. Eventually you will radiate a calm and peace in which you will not experience the violence very frequently...or not at all (I dare say and hope).
I also know this to be true. Mom brought this 10 count CD set of this guy,(I wish I could remember his name!!!) over during her last stay with us. The man spoke of the same principals, To train your human mind to not even relate to hate in any way, thus at some ascending point, actually
becoming one who doesn't care for conflict or hate on any level! And with no effort or human thought pattern first, you just simply become evolved past wanting to control the outcome of a hate or conflict related incident. Leaving it in God's hands. Ascending. Feeling no need to teach the lesson to be learned by the "to be punished" individual, because you know God's got it set up already for that individual to learn this lesson with or without you, so let it go. I believe that yes at some point we are supposed to punish & kill & torture others, because we all have invested lessons in these experiences. And from the experiences, is where we get the
desire to slowly let go & let God. I don't think it would be as easy to grasp this concept, if we first didn't experience where hate and vendetta and retaliation has taken our race. I think that once we get the chance to experience these horrible things here on earth, the actual experience is what creates the need to evolve past having to even deal w/it anymore(and by this I do not mean becomming appethetic), and we start to Karmically pull in the positive, as we leave the neg for God to deal with.
Thank you Alisa for such a thought invested reply!!!
I always enjoy your replies so much, especially when you help me to blend what I might think to be two seperate concepts, into one concept with two parts, each supporting the other to make the whole
. Bless u.
I'm glad to hear you figured out the death thing
, & I like your theory. As all things must come to an end, so must the phasad of ego since we really at a soul level, don't have one. Good for you on the self discovery (or as they say in your neck of the woods, good on ya mate)!!! And I must say, if something has to die, better the ego than you!
Thanx for the always stimulating conversation, you never fail to provide such yummy spiritual snacks!
