Thanks for your further explanations, Jaime. It has helped me think more deeply. I really like your explanation of karma as setting our own boundaries. I had spiritual lessons at one point about being a shepherdess (analogy) and learning to set boundaries for the sheep to walk between. The lesson was you don't have to punish or reward the sheep if you set up clear boundaries with consequences. I find this helpful in all relationships, and particularly parenting. Still working on it, mind you.

I don't mean to be opposed to Seth's ideas on violation, I'm just not 100% knowing what to think. I understand violation and that we have to learn not to violate one another. We each must stay within our own boundaries and not step into others. I just don't know what then to do if someone steps into mine because there has to be a consequence, right? I embrace his idea of thinking aggressively of peace. And killing does seem wrong, but I'm just not sure how to think of things in light of right and wrong these days and what should be done about it by humans other than focusing aggressively on peace. I guess that's where I am at right now in my lessons. I watch docos on prisons and I see the wrongness of imprisoning people, and yet I wonder how it would go to not do it any more. There have to be consequences still...don't you think?

Lately I have been receiving the thought, It is a self-correcting universe. (I guess this is much like the shepherdess lesson). I interpret this in part to be about like attracts like. And I believe it does this to load up one side of the scale so much that the imbalance drives us to begin loading up the other side. Or another analogy is a pendulum, swinging to one side until "gravity" pulls the pendulum back and it then swings out to the other side, each time going to less extremes and coming closer and closer to balance.

With addictions for example...you feel compelled (out of like attracts like to go back and do it again and again and again until you are so sick of it, so ultimately disgusted by the imbalance, that you are motivated enough to overcome it. Therefore, I have to say that there is more going on with us than simply like attracting like otherwise things would never change. There must be an even stronger drive within us (God's will) that craves balance and so no matter how far out we go, something is always pulling us back to middle.

I think it is all a honing process of this self-correcting universe as set up by God, that we are given a flawed, unbalanced personality (a concrete suit for our spirit) so we can struggle and learn and build muscle, indulge to excess and then overcome it.

So back to the original question you posed! Should we torture or punish people? I'd say no, we shouldn't. No matter what we think it will mean or whatever kind of repercussion we fear, we have to believe in peace if we are to experience it. And as you and your mother realized and aspired to...we have to treat others as we wish to be treated and as we wish the world to be.



Ooo, very well put.



Can I steal and say "Ditto!! I needed your reply to help me think more and tie more together. I'm not done yet either, so if you have more, lay it on me baby.

So summarizing...I get that I don't step onto others boundaries, and so I won't. But I am still wondering, should there be consequences given by me if they step on mine? And if so, what and how? Or would giving consequences be stepping back on their boundaries?

Oh, how I'd love to sort this out. Chime in!